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Thread: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of death'

  1. #1
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    ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of death'

    ObamaCare architect Ezekiel Emanuel has anounced the 'optimal age of death' - you won't like it

    Old people are such a burden.

    Democrats seem to love death. Whether they're yammering about abortion or "end of life" planning, they just can't get enough of talking up the myriad ways people can exit life's stage. They always claim this is simply a discussion about personal responsibility and individual choice but, since they despise those ideals in virtually every other matter, it's a hard argument to buy.

    Enter Ezekiel Emanuel.

    Emanuel was one of the chief architects of ObamaCare and is, of course, the brother of Rahm. Over at The Atlantic, he's penned an article about his own death and he's made a shocking announcement about the perfect age at which he hopes to die. While he very specifically rules out euthanasia, Emanuel says he hopes his ticker shuts down at the not-particularly-old age of 75.

    The reason? 75 is, apparently, the perfect age for a human to buy the farm. According to Emanuel, people who live longer than that risk struggling through a less-than-perfect existence.

    Doubtless, death is a loss. It deprives us of experiences and milestones, of time spent with our spouse and children. In short, it deprives us of all the things we value.

    But here is a simple truth that many of us seem to resist: living too long is also a loss. It renders many of us, if not disabled, then faltering and declining, a state that may not be worse than death but is nonetheless deprived. It robs us of our creativity and ability to contribute to work, society, the world. It transforms how people experience us, relate to us, and, most important, remember us. We are no longer remembered as vibrant and engaged but as feeble, ineffectual, even pathetic.

    Emanuel rambles on in a painfully long-winded argument about how modern medicine is extending lives but, in his view, does so by keeping people in a sad, miserable, and often painful state. The elderly are not enjoying being alive and - according to Emanuel - become burdensome shadows of their former selves.

    "living as long as possible has drawbacks we often won’t admit to ourselves. I will leave aside the very real and oppressive financial and caregiving burdens that many, if not most, adults in the so-called sandwich generation are now experiencing, caught between the care of children and parents. Our living too long places real emotional weights on our progeny"

    So, for the sake of their overburdened families, they should probably just snuff it at 75 rather than drag it out for another 20 years. After all, they’re probably pretty unhappy being alive, and their continued existence places a ton of emotional stress on their progeny.

    Sure, their children may love them - and they'll miss them when they're gone - but as long as mom and dad are alive they're putting a lot of pressure on their offspring.

    "But parents also cast a big shadow for most children. Whether estranged, disengaged, or deeply loving, they set expectations, render judgments, impose their opinions, interfere, and are generally a looming presence for even adult children. This can be wonderful. It can be annoying. It can be destructive. But it is inescapable as long as the parent is alive. Examples abound in life and literature: Lear, the quintessential Jewish mother, the Tiger Mom. And while children can never fully escape this weight even after a parent dies, there is much less pressure to conform to parental expectations and demands after they are gone."

    How incredibly, horrifically, selfish.

    Emanuel argues that the price of adding more years to your life is decreased ability. In short, he argues that we're not really adding "life" as much as we're stretching out the process of death - and he wants no part of it.

    The example he gives to showcase the horrors of old age is truly disturbing. Not because the life in question is so miserable, but because it actually sounds pretty great - and it belongs to his own father.

    "My father illustrates the situation well. About a decade ago, just shy of his 77th birthday, he began having pain in his abdomen. Like every good doctor, he kept denying that it was anything important. But after three weeks with no improvement, he was persuaded to see his physician. He had in fact had a heart attack, which led to a cardiac catheterization and ultimately a bypass. Since then, he has not been the same. Once the prototype of a hyperactive Emanuel, suddenly his walking, his talking, his humor got slower. Today he can swim, read the newspaper, needle his kids on the phone, and still live with my mother in their own house. But everything seems sluggish. Although he didn’t die from the heart attack, no one would say he is living a vibrant life. When he discussed it with me, my father said, “I have slowed down tremendously. That is a fact. I no longer make rounds at the hospital or teach.” Despite this, he also said he was happy."

    So, let's get this straight, Ezekiel's own father has a happy, relatively healthy life. He lives with a wife he loves, gets to interact with the children he loves, and can still swim and engage with the world. ...But that's not good enough. He's "slowed down" so, in Emanuel's warped mind, he's a good example of how life after 75 isn't all it’s cracked up to be.

    As he puts it: "the fact is that by 75, creativity, originality, and productivity are pretty much gone for the vast, vast majority of us."

    Emanuel says it's "uniquely American" to assume that you're going to have a happy, healthy life right up until the very end. He calls people who think they're going to avoid the slow decent into death "American Immortals." He claims these immortals believe they're going to be perfectly healthy until they're in their 90's and then just keel over dead one day.

    I've never met anyone who thinks that. We all know that the end of our lives will, more likely than not, involve years of "slowing down" and some time in a hospital bed. Most of us have watched - or helped - someone they love go through the process.

    That doesn't mean we stop fighting for every. single. precious. second.

    Most of us want to spend as long as possible with the people we love. Most of us want to see and do as much as we possibly can, for as long as we possibly can. Most of us are desirous of a medical system which is constantly struggling to give us as much life as science can provide.

    Unfortunately, the man who was - in large part - responsible for Barack Obama's unpopular, rightfully despised, "signature law" is not "most of us."

    I reject this aspiration. I think this manic desperation to endlessly extend life is misguided and potentially destructive.

    In other words: "just take a pain pill."

    http://www.caintv.com/obamacare-architect-ezekiel-em

  2. #2

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    We're all just pawns on a chess board.
    I am going to tear down your safe space
    Brick by brick I shall smash it with glee
    You cannot stop me from getting inside
    I am cold and I am hard and my name is 'Reality'

  3. #3

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    Nope, not frightening at all. I hope people aren't surprised when they find out that socialists don't value the life and rights of the individual. People are just commodities to them, and are to be "disposed of" when they become a burden or unuseful.
    Just a puppy kicking, children starving, grandma shoving, kitten throwing, evil, vile, nasty, disgusting, racist, sexist, bigot.....or so I've been told. :)

  4. #4

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    Quote Originally Posted by ZZ912
    Nope, not frightening at all. I hope people aren't surprised when they find out that socialists don't value the life and rights of the individual. People are just commodities to them, and are to be "disposed of" when they become a burden or unuseful.
    Unless you're part of the ruling elite of course. I rather doubt the author of this article will choose to euthanize himself once he hits 75 years of age.
    I am going to tear down your safe space
    Brick by brick I shall smash it with glee
    You cannot stop me from getting inside
    I am cold and I am hard and my name is 'Reality'

  5. #5
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    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    and people snicker when the term "death panel" is mentioned.

  6. #6

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    What is wrong with you people? It's his personal choice of when he wants to die. Let me repeat that. His personal choice. 75 has nothing to do with the ACA. Nothing to do with any sort of national limitation of life. All it is is one man saying that he personally doesn't want to live past 75. And that should be his right. I hope you see the irony in your posts. For a bunch of people worried about socialism, about letting other people control your lives, you sure do seem oblivious to the fact that you won't even let this man have an opinion on when he would ideally like to die.

  7. #7

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea


  8. #8

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    Amazing how some people get on a message board whose content is extremely important to them and lose all ability to think or reason.



    Obamacare = BOO!!!!!!!

  9. #9
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    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    Amazing how someone who "roots for the other Team"

    Cannot see the forest, for the trees..... SMH

  10. #10

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    Quote Originally Posted by Huey Grey
    What is wrong with you people? It's his personal choice of when he wants to die. Let me repeat that. His personal choice. 75 has nothing to do with the ACA. Nothing to do with any sort of national limitation of life. All it is is one man saying that he personally doesn't want to live past 75. And that should be his right. I hope you see the irony in your posts. For a bunch of people worried about socialism, about letting other people control your lives, you sure do seem oblivious to the fact that you won't even let this man have an opinion on when he would ideally like to die.
    No it isn't. I knew someone would try to come along and justify this. The bottom line is that he knows this is a finite resource and must be rationed, so he's trying to soften people up to this idea.
    I am going to tear down your safe space
    Brick by brick I shall smash it with glee
    You cannot stop me from getting inside
    I am cold and I am hard and my name is 'Reality'

  11. #11

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    Quote Originally Posted by TheOne
    Amazing how some people get on a message board whose content is extremely important to them and lose all ability to think or reason.



    Obamacare = BOO!!!!!!!
    Like it or not, the ACA has it's consequences. I don't know how people can't understand this.
    I am going to tear down your safe space
    Brick by brick I shall smash it with glee
    You cannot stop me from getting inside
    I am cold and I am hard and my name is 'Reality'

  12. #12
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    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    Quote Originally Posted by Huey Grey
    What is wrong with you people? It's his personal choice of when he wants to die. Let me repeat that. His personal choice. 75 has nothing to do with the ACA. Nothing to do with any sort of national limitation of life. All it is is one man saying that he personally doesn't want to live past 75. And that should be his right. I hope you see the irony in your posts. For a bunch of people worried about socialism, about letting other people control your lives, you sure do seem oblivious to the fact that you won't even let this man have an opinion on when he would ideally like to die.


    You don't get it and apparently never will. You're head isn't in the sand, its up the ass of your hero.

  13. #13

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    Quote Originally Posted by Nifster
    Quote Originally Posted by Huey Grey
    What is wrong with you people? It's his personal choice of when he wants to die. Let me repeat that. His personal choice. 75 has nothing to do with the ACA. Nothing to do with any sort of national limitation of life. All it is is one man saying that he personally doesn't want to live past 75. And that should be his right. I hope you see the irony in your posts. For a bunch of people worried about socialism, about letting other people control your lives, you sure do seem oblivious to the fact that you won't even let this man have an opinion on when he would ideally like to die.


    You don't get it and apparently never will. You're head isn't in the sand, its up the ass of your hero.
    Link to there being any sort of national age limit? Otherwise STFU. You people are morons.

  14. #14

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    Quote Originally Posted by NoleSoup4U
    Quote Originally Posted by TheOne
    Amazing how some people get on a message board whose content is extremely important to them and lose all ability to think or reason.



    Obamacare = BOO!!!!!!!
    Like it or not, the ACA has it's consequences. I don't know how people can't understand this.
    Making up a science fiction style age limit isn't a consequence. It's simply you making up something that doesn't exist.

  15. #15

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    [quote=Huey Grey]
    Quote Originally Posted by Nifster
    Quote Originally Posted by "Huey Grey":23dcmdmp
    What is wrong with you people? It's his personal choice of when he wants to die. Let me repeat that. His personal choice. 75 has nothing to do with the ACA. Nothing to do with any sort of national limitation of life. All it is is one man saying that he personally doesn't want to live past 75. And that should be his right. I hope you see the irony in your posts. For a bunch of people worried about socialism, about letting other people control your lives, you sure do seem oblivious to the fact that you won't even let this man have an opinion on when he would ideally like to die.


    You don't get it and apparently never will. You're head isn't in the sand, its up the ass of your hero.
    Link to there being any sort of national age limit? Otherwise STFU. You people are morons.[/quote:23dcmdmp]

    Do you think they would actually come out and say that? The public support to revoke the ACA would be insurmountable. All you have to know about his situation is what I stated earlier. Healthcare is a finite resource. In the past, this resource had been rationed by money. Now that isn't the case, so it needs to find another way to be rationed. Will it be first come, first served? Or will it be something more along the lines of what this guy was talking about?
    I am going to tear down your safe space
    Brick by brick I shall smash it with glee
    You cannot stop me from getting inside
    I am cold and I am hard and my name is 'Reality'

  16. #16

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    [quote=NoleSoup4U]
    Quote Originally Posted by Huey Grey
    Quote Originally Posted by Nifster
    Quote Originally Posted by "Huey Grey":1erfsskm
    What is wrong with you people? It's his personal choice of when he wants to die. Let me repeat that. His personal choice. 75 has nothing to do with the ACA. Nothing to do with any sort of national limitation of life. All it is is one man saying that he personally doesn't want to live past 75. And that should be his right. I hope you see the irony in your posts. For a bunch of people worried about socialism, about letting other people control your lives, you sure do seem oblivious to the fact that you won't even let this man have an opinion on when he would ideally like to die.


    You don't get it and apparently never will. You're head isn't in the sand, its up the ass of your hero.
    Link to there being any sort of national age limit? Otherwise STFU. You people are morons.
    Do you think they would actually come out and say that? The public support to revoke the ACA would be insurmountable. All you have to know about his situation is what I stated earlier. Healthcare is a finite resource. In the past, this resource had been rationed by money. Now that isn't the case, so it needs to find another way to be rationed. Will it be first come, first served? Or will it be something more along the lines of what this guy was talking about?[/quote:1erfsskm]
    Please explain how healthcare is no longer rationed by money? Also please explain how healthcare wasn't previously rationed by time? Do you see why I have a hard time buying your argument? You're simply making up assertions that don't really exist.

  17. #17

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    [quote=Huey Grey][quote=NoleSoup4U]
    Quote Originally Posted by "Huey Grey":1mf5595s
    Quote Originally Posted by Nifster
    Quote Originally Posted by "Huey Grey":1mf5595s
    What is wrong with you people? It's his personal choice of when he wants to die. Let me repeat that. His personal choice. 75 has nothing to do with the ACA. Nothing to do with any sort of national limitation of life. All it is is one man saying that he personally doesn't want to live past 75. And that should be his right. I hope you see the irony in your posts. For a bunch of people worried about socialism, about letting other people control your lives, you sure do seem oblivious to the fact that you won't even let this man have an opinion on when he would ideally like to die.


    You don't get it and apparently never will. You're head isn't in the sand, its up the ass of your hero.
    Link to there being any sort of national age limit? Otherwise STFU. You people are morons.
    Do you think they would actually come out and say that? The public support to revoke the ACA would be insurmountable. All you have to know about his situation is what I stated earlier. Healthcare is a finite resource. In the past, this resource had been rationed by money. Now that isn't the case, so it needs to find another way to be rationed. Will it be first come, first served? Or will it be something more along the lines of what this guy was talking about?[/quote:1mf5595s]
    Please explain how healthcare is no longer rationed by money? Also please explain how healthcare wasn't previously rationed by time? Do you see why I have a hard time buying your argument? You're simply making up assertions that don't really exist.[/quote:1mf5595s]

    How is it not rationed by money? Do you mean besides the fact that many policies are now subsidized by the tax payer? I guess that part is made up.
    I am going to tear down your safe space
    Brick by brick I shall smash it with glee
    You cannot stop me from getting inside
    I am cold and I am hard and my name is 'Reality'

  18. #18
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    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    Rah Rah Rah.... Go Team.

    Huey has been brain dead for a while.

    Common sense has ran away from him LONG AGO.

  19. #19

    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    Good thread, except for the ACA paranoia nonsense. For those who want to read Emmanuel's Atlantic article:

    http://www.theatlantic.com/features/arc ... 75/379329/

    While I don't agree with him, there is much that is thought provoking about a subject both universal and unique to our time because of our increased longevity. For the paranoid, he is not recommending any changes to medical opportunities, or even that others agree with him. As a doctor he affirms his commitment to providing the best care to his patients in achieving their goals, not his. He ends on a humorous note, after earlier commenting on the pattern of creative thinking ending among most humans in middle age. Specifically:

    "...Again, let me be clear: I am not saying that those who want to live as long as possible are unethical or wrong. I am certainly not scorning or dismissing people who want to live on despite their physical and mental limitations. I’m not even trying to convince anyone I’m right. Indeed, I often advise people in this age group on how to get the best medical care available in the United States for their ailments. That is their choice, and I want to support them.

    And I am not advocating 75 as the official statistic of a complete, good life in order to save resources, ration health care, or address public-policy issues arising from the increases in life expectancy. What I am trying to do is delineate my views for a good life and make my friends and others think about how they want to live as they grow older. I want them to think of an alternative to succumbing to that slow constriction of activities and aspirations imperceptibly imposed by aging. Are we to embrace the “American immortal” or my “75 and no more” view?

    ...Seventy-five years is all I want to live. I want to celebrate my life while I am still in my prime. My daughters and dear friends will continue to try to convince me that I am wrong and can live a valuable life much longer. And I retain the right to change my mind and offer a vigorous and reasoned defense of living as long as possible. That, after all, would mean still being creative after 75."

    I don't agree with him because of my experience (and my wife's) with our parents. We were lucky enough that they lived into their 90's and maintained full mental capacity (my mother correcting me on the day she died on the date of an upcoming appointment). They all went fast when they died - hours or a few days - but the last few years were a struggle for them. I'm not sure, based on this experience, that I want to make into my 90's, and so I plan on dying young - 85-89? - and leaving a beautiful corpse.

  20. #20
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    Re: ObamaCare architect has anounced the 'optimal age of dea

    No thanks,... We have no use for the Froot Loop Teams Propaganda.

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